Ok, so just to get this straight...All the Joes we have seen at the con..that's it...end of story till the movie comes out?

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I blame it on that darn Interweb , those Nintenders and X-Stations.

Same old song. It's all about character recognition and attention span.
25 years ago RAH was everywhere and 4 out of 5 little boys had GIJoes.
Store had full assortments and most of the time it was easy to get every characters depicted on the backer card.
Then we got a cartoon to fuel our passion even more.

Today, it takes massive media support for a toy line to be popular.
A weekly cartoon, a movie and in many case a game or a gimmick for kids to be focused on the line.
We all know that... except for Hasbro who wants to sell to kids, yet they remove the weekly cartoon from the air, because a movie is coming... NEXT YEAR. So how do they expect to stay in the kids' eyes until then?
No matter how many Dukes they put on the pegs, kids don't know Duke anymore than they know Dick Tracy.

They know the super-heroes, the new anime hero of the month and the latest cute monsters card game, but for them, GIJoe is just a random military line that barely has two pegs in the middle of it all.

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Crap.

I hate it when I'm right about stuff like this.

And with the answers to some of those questions, it seems like my dark future scenario is actually approahing even faster than I thought.

great more excuses, funny how the OTHER Hasbro lines don't have to use those same excuses very often when the same questions are asked, perhapes the Joe guys think too few people pay attention to one line.

However this did kind of brought down my high from SDCC, Even though no joe was shown I figured it was being held back to NYCC cause of production ect. NOPE! Some big 30th celebration. Something odd I noticed was even the Joe guys contradicted each other (First one said 3 more waves, next guy said that was it) which indicates a massive level of disorganization within the GI Joe design team, the differeing excuses from the lines indicates this could be Hasbro wide, but could be a symtom of the Joe disorganization as well. Also wasn't it a few days ago we were told Kwinn would be out in a later wave? So yeah this sounds like another case of the right hand doesn't know what the left hand is doing. It would seem that the group would get together just before such a big event such as SDCC to get the story striaght (and to clarify any downward communication) in order to put the best foot forward and have a clear message (even if it was bad news).

This is the kind of crap that gets me frustrated with the Joe brand. Make any excuse you want, the line is clearly mismanaged and disorganized and signs show it has been for a long, long time. I am sure there will be a bunch of excuses in the next few posts, but this is a MAJOR corperation and such things SHOULDN'T happen (and to be clear I am meaning the lack of communication and organization, NOT the threat to GI Joe AGAIN). If they don't get thier act together, Joe will die (and probably go to a failing internet exclusive, OH MARKETED TO ADULTS AGAIN!!).

Wow what a mess.

If this is the case, then let's make sure we have the right quotes and sources, then actually follow through by sending a letter (or sorts) to Hasbro stating our concerns about the line and the disparity towards it versus the other lines.

Maybe mention that we are concerned that those involved are presenting information at media level venues and contradicting each other.

Express our concern at this and go from there.

Maybe something we can all print out, sign, and send to Hasbro.

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The whole industry is mismanaged. The smaller companies that are really I to the stuff try and get in, and they quickly learn the collector market is what they sell to. Sideshow, NECA, Art Asylum, so many more. Yeah sure some of them went in with the collie tore only in mind but many did not. Plus you really think none of these would step up if they could market a product sold worldwide at chain stores?

Between not wanting to play with what their brother and sisters were into or even parents, and the industry trying to pull the kids in all directions, they also get pushed into peer pressure by the industry. They create things and sometimes do something right to get a following, then they "reinvent it" whether it's doing well or not. "To keep things fresh" they say. Most kids seem to view stuff as erratic as the industry puts things out now.

Another thing I wonder, the glut of collectors came from the 80s. They hit the right buttons and created fans. Most of us have been life long loyal fans. Now seeing these people this weekend at the convention, I wonder if these kids are from "ex-collector" parents. Several of these parents seemed to push their kids away as if they were afraid to get their kids into something. Like they were trying to be sure their kid didn't become a collector. All the."you have enough toys already" or "what are you going to do with it when you get it?" or "no we aren't going to start that." Just lots of stuff that makes you wonder.

I would actually say we are looking at a low ratio for kids to adults. I would say for every 10 collectors there is only maybe 3 kids. I don't care what Hasbro says, any other toy company, or other armchair fans. I've seen it first hand working at KB Toys, I've sold at a couple conventions, and all the other outlets I have had that's given me first hand knowledge. Plus it doesn't take much to use your eyes in the toy aisle when you're in store. The average age of toy buyers seem to be 4 - 7 also which is an awful small crowd to pitch to.

It just does look good for action figures unless the companies stop the tired old "collectors are a small market". I still think if collectors just stopped buying, it would be a huge visual for the toy companies and the fans who act as parrots for these companies and recite everything they say. Things will keep on as is however until the industry does it's self in. We won't be around to have to see imagination take a backseat to stupidity at least

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Too many people don't care though. Fair weather fans. They'd rather call those that want to stand up and say something nuts and make fun of them on private lists and such. Then when there's a high point again they show up and high five everybody.

I don't know if you call it being nuts or passionate towards in being a fan. Either way there are a lot of us that do feel a strong attachment and want to try and bring a change. We're just pretty much sitting with our hands tied. And I guess that's where the fans are that make fun of us. They figure why bother and see no point in those that still want to try.

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Damn. The tone around Joe right now sounds really bleak.


Does the movie get the blame for this? It's pretty obvious the movie line didn't sell like the gangbusters Hasbro was looking for. Ever since then everything seems to have been going downhill. Yes we've gotten some real good stuff in POC and I'm looking forward to a lot of the stuff coming our way (hopefully!) but it's been hard to find stuff at retail since the movie glut and things do NOT sound like they're going to get any better any time soon.

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I do appreciate the effort put into what we have gotten and seen. It's just old to hear " collectors are a small percentage of the market" and "female figures do not sell" along with all the other text book ideas.

My posts end up sounding like a rant, but all I'm doing is posting what I'm seeing in the market. Stating the obvious. I always seem to have an issue with knowing how to make a small post, hehe.

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Honestly, if they're going to ditch an accessory on him for cost's sake, I think the real chain weapon will be first to go.

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No new joes until the movie? Fine by me...gives me a chance to save money now that these are sitting on the pegs at my WM



UPDATE: Please note that pic is a reference, not an offer to pickup/ship joes. I have very little money and even less time to do so. Sorry...

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Just for you maybe but there are a LOT of people still looking for those very figures you have peg warming there at WM.... Check the trade section out and people are looking for the Vipers, Rock Vipers, Iron Grenadier heavy gunner and so on.

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not at all Jman... you've actually been right on the money.

i was just mentioning that in Terrordrome chat that hasbro's two biggest problems in the Joe line are:

1) No Advertizement

anyone else notice that G.I.joe is the only BOYS division toyline to NOT ave any TV advertizement? If "W sell to kids' was so important, wouldn't commercials on the hub, or ANY other cartoon channel would be important.. If Children really float the line, we'd be seeing more Joe commercials on Saturday mornings and summertime than that creepy "Lolla Loopsey" dolls! even comic book advertizement has dropped.

what pulled us all in in the 80's was the commercials. with the combination of animation and the actual product being shown in play (who hear DOESN'T remember "nobody beats G.I.joe!"?) and because there was brand recognition and a cartoon to push the play fantasy. GIjoe became the #2 toy behind transformers and even managed to stay ahead of ninja turtles and he-man.

but,.... now G.I.joe is Virtually ignored, liek they want to keep the toy line secret from children:

a) if G.I.joe is a child driven toyline, why do you invite COLLECTORS to Toyfair?

b) if G.I.joe is a child driven toyline, why is the main push for the line always in venues that CHILDREN USUALLY DON'T HAVE ACCESS TO? (how many kids vs adults go to Joecon and SDCC?)

hell, ever since the whole Chinese lead Paint incident a few yeas back, Action figures were even CLASSIFIED LEGALLY as adult collectibles in order to avoid the cost and lawsuits of changing paints.

2) Misguided Management.

How is it possible that the SAME rediculous thought are int he Bigwigs heads, despire what the brand managers are telling them?

a) female figures dont sell
Im assuming their basing this on either old 80's research, or the sales of ROC (which they didnt bother to cross reference the fact that the head sculpts were HORRIBLE) Especially considering that Zarana SOLD OUT at the con, and collectors keep ASKING for more female figures.

If Hasbro is Truly a Business, and in the Business of Selling toys, and the consumers are ASKING for female figs, why the hell not give it to us? Consumers asked for new flavors of soft drinks and we Got Coke with Lime, Vanilla coke, and so on...

Hell the Star wars line has a figure for virtually EVERY character int he mythos, Even the Ice cream maker guy has a figure, and he was on screen for what? 12 milliseconds?!
...all because someone asked for him.
It seems that the brand managers want one thing, then the execs seem to come int and kneecap them. particularly in THIS line.

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Because Hasbro's employees all grew up and are fans of the older stuff, and as such want to make stuff to make adult fans happy, and sometimes that means having to go the collector-exclusive route. Besides, the design teams still appreciate the devotion the adult fans have for the brand.
Just because kids make up the main purchasing percentage doesn't mean fanboys can't get tossed a bone every year.



You've got me there, I noticed the 25th female figures sold decently. Heck, Helix, horrible a character as she is, sold decently.


Maybe you should run a poll across toy boards... see how many adult fans there actually are buying Joe toys. After all, a few hundred fans asking Hasbro at SDCC isn't exactly the same as people all across retail asking for them.

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I have very little money left after this weekend and even less time with my work week. I can say the WM is in Hamilton, NJ (Mercer County) in 08690...happy hunting!

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